26 Jun 21
Recently I was looking for an old damaged military saddle to use to help repair and refurbish a saddle project that I have had on the bench for a while.
Having spotted a saddle for sale that looked in poor order but with some of the leather parts looked recoverable. Having chatted to the seller, he described it as a bare bones saddles that was missing the padding while the photos suggesting that it was a Universal Pattern Saddle.
Having collected the saddle the first look was that it was a very dirty 1903 UP saddle, with the leather rather dry, and the felt pads being in need of a really good clean .
However once the felts were off the saddle arches looked a bit different, a quite check of a couple of reference books and it became apparent that this wasn’t an 1902 Saddle but possibly an 1890.
A bit more research and it was indeed a 1890 UP Saddle, and while very dirty and dry the leather of the saddle wasn’t in bad condition. Another chat with the Seller to ask where the saddle came from or if he had any information on the background of the saddle. The saddle was from a farm sale and was part of a job lot of old saddles from a barn.
Having confirm that my saddle find is a 1890 UP saddle it has been a case to look to see what condition it is in. An initial brush down to get the first layer of dirt off, and then look at getting the seat leather off.
The laces holding it on at the front and rear are all shot and fell apart as I worked them through. the stitching on the seat is mostly good so a few careful stitches will fix that. all of the leather will need a good clean and nourishment but overall isn’t bad condition.
The seat took some gentle easing to get off the arches but came off with no issues and intact. The flaps were next, these are held on with flat slot head screws and which were a complete bugger to undo. but with them off they are ready to be cleaned.
Inspecting the webbing that supports the seat it was no surprise to see that it was really grotty and worn through, so that will be a complete replacement job.
Now being able to have a better look at the steel arches it was a case to look for any damage or cracking and both look good and solid. some light surface rust but that can be cleaned up quite easily.
I also placed the Saddle tree (arches and boards) on a flat surface to check to see if there was a twist and to see if there were movement between the arches and the boards. Luckily the saddle is solid and true so it will be fine to ridden once the leather and webbing is sorted.
Having cleaned some of the grime from the Fans (wooden boards) there is the makers mark of Mason & Sons Ltd of Brum and a year mark of 1903. Which is a very nice find as it gives a reference date for the saddle.
The Y Girth straps do look like they have been replaced at some point, which isn’t unusual. the buckle end looks original but the rest looks like a replacement. These both need a bit of repair work but I know good saddler that could easily do that for me.
So overall what was meant to be a scrap saddle for parts looks like a saddle that can be brought back into riding condition without changing it too much or losing it’s character. so over the next few weeks will have a case of some good scrubbing and work with the leather dressing
Hi,
Your 1890 pattern saddle is a great find…….congrats.
Did you ever manage to restore it?
If yes……..any pictures??
Regards,
Philip.
Morning Philip,
Yes the restoration has started and there will be a blog post with photos being done in the next 2 weeks.
Regards
Will
Thanks Will.
I certainly look forward to reading and seeing the pics as I have undertaken similar projects on old army saddles in the past.
Very best regards,
Philip.
Philip,
just posted a progress update on the work on the 1890 UP
https://horsebacksapper.co.uk/2023/08/26/1890-up-saddle-refurbishment-update/
let me know what you think.
Regards
Will
Hi Will,
Many thanks for the update.
Really fantastic progress and really great pictures.
I love the way you are taking your time with the restoration and not trying to rush things.
I was at a multi-period re-enactors event in Kent yesterday (I live in Kent), but sadly no saddlery stuff to buy.
Very best regards,
Philip.
Evening Philip,
Many Thanks, it is coming on but I do need to get on with it a bit faster, but I do want to get it right.
As for the availability of WW1 period and Military saddlery it is getting harder to find. the thing to watch out for is things like the Indian Army UP Saddles that something get tarted up to look like British or Canadian UPs. The Indian UP is lower quality material and set for smaller horses.
while it sound like a bad thing for the saddles, it does makes sense as it does mean that if you are in a Indian Cavalry unit it is easier to carry out repairs with rougher material. The problem comes that there are a few sellers that will market them as conventional UPs.
The other thing is that UPs are in limited numbers for the current British Army units and as such they are being repaired and kept in service.
The best way I’ve found is just to keep a watch for “Barn finds” – a lot of saddles were sold after WW2 and were bought cheap for use on Farms, stable yards etc. The police bought quite a few for their mounted sections.
so it is a case of just keeping an eye out for them.
Regards
Will
Hi Will,
As an after-thought……..
Do you have any idea of what one of these saddles might be worth?
Very best regards,
Philip.
Philip,
The cost can be a real mixed bag. there is a seller on EBay that regularly has UPs for sale at £400-£450 each….but I keep seeing the same ones being listed so I think they are priced too high, I also think the market for them is not as popular as it was – the centenary of the Great War brought lots of interest but that seems to have tailed off a little
Indian UPs used to appear at £50-£75 but they seem to have disappeared other than the occasional one that appears on ebay trying to pretend to be a British or Canadian UP
I’ve found my UPs by looking for ones that are damaged or rated at poor condition, they have been £90-150 and then I’ve worked on repairing them. The 1890 UP was bought for £90 on the grounds that it was a 1902 UP in poor condition and I would salvage the leatherwork to make a descent UP from a set of boards and arches that I had purchased as scrap – I’ve still got them and still looking for bits of leather for it.
UP Headset and bridles can be picked up in various conditions and levels of completeness from £30 to £150. A good quality reproduction set would be £180-£200 but with that you get a good set multi purpose riding set.
One of the things that was suggested to me was that a cheap alternative to a Staff Officer’s saddle was to look out for a Vintage hunting Saddle as some of them are very similar and can be picked up for £20-£50 and then for maybe another £50 a saddler or leather worker could do some modifications to make it passable for events particularly if you add a set of wallets and some rolled kit to the rear of the saddle.
The place where the saddles still get a reasonable price is the US and Canada as they are known as Trooper Saddles and modern versions are made and they are seen as endurance/ treking saddles and are a working alternative to the western saddles. Prices are higher over there but they do tend to make the seats more padded and bit more ornate.
So what are they worth? They are worth what you want to pay for it. I’m in the habit now that I don’t like riding on a normal GP saddle, I like the UP with Saddle wallets and riding it Boer/ Farmer style and watch a riding instructor/ Modern Rider throwing a dickie fit, but I know that I can do 25 miles in my UP and still get on it the next day. So to that end I’ll take my £100 repaired 1902 UP over the £800 GP saddle that my friend rides in.
Regards
Will
Hi Will,
So sorry for the late reply, but I’ve beed surprisingly busy lately.
Many thanks for the in depth info regarding the ’02 pattern saddles and their worth……..you certainly seem to know your stuff.
I have been collecting old army saddlery and saddle kit for about 30 years and have several ’02 saddles, plus several Officers saddles, plus Yeomanry.
It was really your 1890 pattern that I was most interested in as I only have one of those.
If you want to see any pics of my stuff, please let me know your normal email address.
Very best regards,
Philip.